RUB pending payment
Assuming that payments will eventually start flowing from russian lending companies, are we assuming that investors will receive all pending funds with pending payment interest? I don't expect any exceptions here.
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JH, there is no separate document that can be publicly shared but our approach has been always the same and we've been communicating it to investors clearly many times since the launch of pending payments. You can read a detailed explanation of pending payments functionality e.g. here.
As mentioned in the article, "except for the unusual cases that are driven by events outside the control of lending companies, Mintos enforces penalties for late settlements, including paying interest on pending payments to investors."
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Dear Anna,
the document you reference is not valid for my contracts.
My contracts have been founded before this document was published.
If there is no other information then pending payment interest is an substantial part of the contact between Mintos, Kviku and JH.Please confirm.
Could you please post „many informations“ about pending payment interest published before April 2022.
Best regards
JH
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Fjvera and MP, as far as we know, no one else in the industry has managed to receive significant repayments directly from Russian lending companies due to imposed limitations. When investors have received some repayments, these are cases when other group entities performing lending are covering this from their profit. In our case, e.g. MikroKapital has been covering their payments, while others that don't have a group guarantee nor significant operations outside Russia, cannot do that.
In the following days, we aim to publish a Q&A about funds in recovery, where we are going to share more insight on this topic.
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JH, Yes, the policy on pending payments is a part of the agreements between Mintos and each lending company.
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Dear Anna,
why did Mintos offer late payment interest to Investors of Kviku if this is not guaranteed?
If Mintos has different contracts with Kviku then the contracts with investors, Mintos is causing the problem. Mintos has to cover the agreed and guaranteed late payment interest in full.Please confirm!
Best regards
JH
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Has anybody talked to a lawyer about late payment interest?
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Hello Pawel,
currently we should ask Mintos all relevant questions.
This helps to show other investors the real face of Mintos.
After receiving payments without late payment interest investors should look into the easiest way putting Mintos into legal responsibility. One possibility is a „European dunning notice“ (cost 32€ up to 1000€ open value). All investors which have this problem should send such a notice for ONE loan where late payment interest is missing.Until then … ask questions.
Best regardsJH
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Dear JH,
Let us highlight one more time that the pending payment interest not being charged is not a matter that required a legal document with a timestamp to be provided to the investors. The late interest is something that the lending companies pay under the contracts with Mintos. In the assignment agreements, there is a reference to a cooperation agreement and other transaction documents concluded with the lending company. Note that exercising and enforcing rights under a contract requires application of the law and interpretation, and acting in good faith.0 -
Today, PEERBERRY platform has made another payment of loans withheld from Ukraine and Russia due to the war.
However, MINTOS continues without repaying the loans affected by the war in Ukraine and Russia.
One platform has sought solutions for its investors and another has forgotten them.
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Fjvera As we announced in our last updates, we received a repayment of €1.3m from Revo. The money will be distributed to investors shortly.
https://www.mintos.com/blog/russia-ukraine-war-impact-update-swift-ban-rub-plunge-pausing-listing-new-loans-from-belarus-and-more/0 -
Hello Lucia. Has any Russian LO, apart from REVO, agreed to pay off its debt? It's been 8 months now and I still haven't received a cent from my 3 million investment. in Russia . These companies are constantly dealing with our money and making money on it.
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Which company/person receives the bank interest of late payments or loans in recovery?
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Annija, Lucja,
As i see in update. Micro Capital made a payment 414k e. This is above the limit of 10 million Rubles. Do other companies talk to the central bank. What are the activities of mintos? As investors, are we waiting for Russia to nationalize and appropriate banking assets?1 -
Christopher We are currently working on improvements and, with the next recovery update, we will provide more detailed feedback on each lending company from Russia separately to provide more clarity and transparency.
JH When funds are in the recovery process, our main objective is always to recover the principal and then, if possible, the interest that has accrued up to the point at which the companies were suspended. When companies are in the recovery process, no interest is accrued for late payments.0 -
Dear Lucja,
please explain in detail why there is no interest for loans in recovery.
Best regards
Jochen
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This question is still open:
Which company/person receives the bank interest of late payments or loans in recovery?
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JH when the company has got difficulties, there is a risk of losses for investors. As mentioned, if the company might not be able to repay everything to investors, our highest priority is to recover the principal amount. Imposing on them additional interest could decrease the chances to reach this goal.
Please explain what you refer to by bank interest in this context.
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Paweł Andrzej Lechowicz Mikro Capital is in different structure, so this specific restriction does not apply for them. They have been paying bigger amounts from the start.
On the opposite, we are doing everything to avoid the nationalization scenario, hence we are looking for ways that the lending companies can make payments directly without the government's involvement.
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Explanation:
If Kviku holds late payments on their bank account which person or company receives the interest which the bank is paying to the owner of the bank account?3 -
Lucja (Mintos), we are waiting for update.
Can a loan company set up a daughter company / partner company to bypass the limits? Kviku is a large, global company, also in Europe! why is it not possible to transfer capital from a branch from Russia to a branch in Europe? Lack of funds? Ask because, according to the information on the Kvik website, in 2023 they will start in Vietnam and Indonesia. Impossible.Next, JH is asking a lot of times.
You pretend you don't see the question?
It is simple: What is going on with our funds? Are they on an interest-paid account, or maybe the company trades them?
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Dear Mintos-Team,
it is clear that lending companies from Russia can't transfer Rub or Euro to the EU.
However why I can not reinvest into loans from russia maybe from the same lending company to earn money during war - do they don't forward their business? They need only my approval...
Where are the Rub stored, on the account of the company or on an account of a thrusted company? Who will check that the lending companies don't make still business with the money of investors and maybe lost them?
Why are other P2P companies able to transfer money back from russian lending companies but Mintos not?
I think for nobody is the actual situation nice, but I think if Mintos and Russian leding companies are more motivated, they could find a better solution for the investors, mintos and the russian lending companies. Actually Mintos tell us they are searching for new ways to transfer some money... but what has Mintos reached approximate after 1 year... quite less...
Maybe a new start is needed to find better solution for the situation, because the actual way of Mintos is very ineffective and doesn't help investors, russian lending companies or Mintos to make money...
kind regards...
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@Lucja, As i see you are active in other threads. Did you mention regular updates?
I think it is necessary to change the community manager. Lucja and Annija are not credible.The last RUB transaction on my account is from June. Why does companies not transfer RUB 10 million every month.
Peerbery pays every month.
Other question for the community.
Only active investors care about recovering RUB? Where are you ? This is our money!2 -
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On my account, I see that pending payment of Revo was few times reduced. However, in monthly overview in Mintos app, I do not see any received interests (not a single cent) coming from Revo during the last months. Checking your latest update from November ( https://assets.mintos.com/01310ADD-D548-93F8-92BB-22D4AB108EC2.xlsx ), we see that Revo has done some payments for principal recovery, however no interests have been transferred. How is it possible? Have we lent money for free? I mean, due to war limitations, they hold the money for many additional months without any additional interests, whereas they could be able to re-invest that money in meantime in Russian market for own interests. And now, they do not even pay the regular interests for original borrow.(2)
In latest update from 10 November 2022 ( https://www.mintos.com/blog/russia-ukraine-war-impact-update-swift-ban-rub-plunge-pausing-listing-new-loans-from-belarus-and-more/ ), you wrote: “Kviku: We’re in the process of negotiating a repayment agreement. As the company has a substantial exposure, it is working on an agreement with the Central Bank of Russia to make larger payments than RUB 10m per month.”
However, where are the monthly payments about of RUB 10m up to now. It’s nice to hear that they do their best to find a way to make larger payments more than RUB 10m per month. However, does it make any sense, as long as they are already not able to transfer RUB 10m per month or as long as they do not really want? Why don’t they utilize fully the limit by governments. In your latest update about recovery in October (https://assets.mintos.com/E8AD47E2-8D26-BDBD-D772-F4D4BD40BA9E.pdf), you show that they have transferred ONLY RUB 5985. So, let us realize: RUB 5985 is much much much much much less than RUB 10m. Where is the rest?
Checking your updates for previous months (e.g recovery in June, July, August, September), we see that Kviku has paid back NOTHING.
Your update about that they try to pay more than RUB 10m does not make any sense as long as they already do not really want to pay more. Even dupliation / triplication of zero RUB still means zero RUB. That's a bad and saddening joke.
The same is true for several other affected companies. Why don’t they utilize fully the limit of RUB 10m per month?2 -
Approval of new comments is partly delayed or blocked. Therefore, no further contribution from other users. In my case waiting since last week.
Supplement: Lucja (Mintos), it's possible that you saw today only post from one day ago. Yesterday, I deletet the one from last week (since approval has not worked / has not been done yet) and generate a new reply but with same content.
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Dear Investors, we apologize for the delay in responding to your concerns, and we assure you that we are monitoring and acknowledging all your questions. We will try to answer them as soon as possible.
Thomas Breuer your comment appeared only yesterday and for some reason it got stuck in spam, however it has been approved now.0 -
Dear Investors, thank you for patience.
Paweł Andrzej Lechowicz In response to your question: Can a loan company set up a daughter company / partner company to bypass the limits? Note that in the current circumstances, due to the restrictions, it is not so easy for Russian companies to open branches in European countries. If they were able to set up a branch/subsidiary in Europe, the same restrictions would apply to making transfers to that European entity.
And even if they were able, the lending companies are either holding repayments from borrowers for loans that investors on Mintos have invested in as cash, or using them to issue new loans until they are able to transfer the money to Mintos. This depends on the lending company, and in many cases in our understanding would be a combination of both.
As far as the second question is concerned, we will answer it shortly.
Thomas Breuer in response to your questions:
1) In all recovery cases, the main focus is to get back the principle. This is a recovery case, as the normal way of conducting business is not possible. This is the best way to get the most funds back the fastest and minimizing losses. This is not a case like Aforti where there are function legislations and biding treaties where that we can push for max return. The fact that we are getting funds is already extra work from all involved sides to get extra permissions from the Russian government to make large transfers to happen.
2) They are in last stages to get the 10M Rub payment. But regardless of that, the exposure is too big for it to make sense. Therefore, we already proactively ask for a similar scenario where they get the extra permission to be able to return larger amounts faster. This most likely will come with a cut, as it is with Revo. But again, looking at the whole situation, the main goal is to retrieve as much principle as possible as fast as possible.3) The 10M RUB is kind of the safe option if all other options fail. As it still implies that if lending company has exposure over 1.5M € that it will take at least a year to get the funds back. In KVIKU case it is 36M so with the exchange rate of 10M Rub being 160K (This is even better than google FX rate gives us) it will take 18 years to pay back all the exposure.
MaK We have not forgotten your question and will answer it shortly.
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Dear Lucja,
I did not receive answer to my question.
“Which company/person receives the bank interest of late payments or loans in recovery?“Please answer the clear question of MaK, too.
“However why I can not reinvest into loans from russia maybe from the same lending company to earn money during war - do they don't forward their business? They need only my approval...”
Best regards
JH
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@Lucja
Thank you for your reply. I do not understand two points:
- We know there is war. However, e.g. Kviku is allowed to transfer RUB 10m per month. There is no other restriction, why they couldn’t pay back that amount of money monthly. So: what is the exact reason, why they do not fully utilize the limit by governments, if there is no restriction by any government?
In your latest update about recovery in October (https://assets.mintos.com/E8AD47E2-8D26-BDBD-D772-F4D4BD40BA9E.pdf), you show that they have transferred ONLY RUB 5985. So, let us realize: RUB 5985 is much much much much much less than RUB 10m. Where is the rest?
Checking your updates for previous months (e.g recovery in June, July, August, September), we see that Kviku has paid back NOTHING.What is the problem that we do not see monthly payback about RUB 10m by Kviku and other candidates?
I mean: up to now, nobody has mentioned that Kviku etc. has a general problem with paying money (excluding the above transfer limitation, which is obviously not the present reason).
- You said: “In all recovery cases, the main focus is to get back the principle.” I understand that is true for normal reason, in case of financial difficulties (e.g. caused by insolvency/bankrupt). However, we all know in case of RUB companies (e.g. Revo) the situation is different. There is no inability to pay due to missing money. Revo has got all the money (our principal and our interest). In principle, they are able to pay back everything. The only problem is the monthly limited money transfer. Therefore, I cannot follow your conclusion that your focus is just on principal and that you do not care about that they do no transfer interest. For them it would not matter if they use RUB 10m only for paying back principal or for principal + interest (since they have all the money). You never mentioned that there is any other issue e.g. insolvency. Up to know, you mentioned only the transfer limitation by government. Therefore, there is no reason, why they should not pay the interest. In that situation nobody would accept that we lend money for free as long as they have got principal and interest to transfer to Mintos. Furthermore, they still could invest our money to earn new interest for their own since couple of months.
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Dear JH
When it comes to pending payments, there will be extra interest paid for funds that are over the 10-day limit to investors.
Regarding funds invested in loans from Russian lending companies, we have already stated that we don't know exactly where the money is held in each case. But it is clear that the only way lending companies would be earning "bank interest" is if they put it in a long-term deposit, which would make the funds unavailable for some time. Therefore, as mentioned previously, the lending companies are either holding repayments from borrowers for loans that investors on Mintos have invested in as cash, or using them to issue new loans until they are able to transfer the money to Mintos. This depends on the lending company, and in many cases, in our understanding, would be a combination of both.
Reinvesting in other Russian loans is not possible due to sanctions and the difficulties in transferring money.-1 -
Dear Lucija,
your comment is not correct.
https://www.cbr.ru/vfs/eng/statistics/pdko/int_rat/deposits_e.xlsx
Please have a look into this file.
It is clearly stated, that there iwas a valuable interest paid for short term bank deposits.
Could you please answer my question about the amount of intrest Kviku realised for open paiments since february 2022.Best regards
JH
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